HIGHLA-L Digest - 11 Apr 2002 to 12 Apr 2002 (#2002-44)
Automatic digest processor (LISTSERV@lists.psu.edu)
Fri, 12 Apr 2002 22:00:01 -0400
There are 12 messages totalling 497 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. Highlander the musical (8)
2. Highlander: The Musical LYRICS!!!!! (3)
3. Highlander: The Musical
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Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 09:07:49 +0200
From: Tarryn Zank <Zankt@nu.ac.za>
Subject: Re: Highlander the musical
How long has this project been in the workings? At the con last year in LA, the PTB's were hinting at another HL series, that they couldn't tell us about, because they still hadn't received 'backing' from the studios. But they did tell us it was tentatively called HL: Trinity. So what's happened, is this 'musical' ('scuse me while I hurl in a bucket - and no it's not musicals I hate, it's the thought of HL as one!) a side project, or did the series concept fail so badly they had to scrape the barrel? The PTB's have either been delving into some exotic drugs, or got whacked too many times on the head by fans at conventions for HL2/3/4... (and Marina extending her flag pole to get them for AAA. - I know, I know, it doesn't exist, we never saw it in South Africa; happy Marina?)
But seriously, is there not something that we as the Highlander community can do? We have seen what can happen when fans get together and campaign for something (return of Sentinel, Roswell), would it not be possible for a project to be cancelled due to the fans utter disgust and horror? I realise that this might hurt any future projects of the HL franchise, but if this is the best they can come up with, do we really want them to try again?
Tarryn
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 09:15:19 -0400
From: pgannon <pgannon@OPTonline.net>
Subject: Re: Highlander: The Musical LYRICS!!!!!
ROTFLMAO
John, You definitely have "a gift!" When can we expect Act II?
Peggie ;-P
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Mosby (B)" <a.j.mosby@btinternet.com>
To: <HIGHLA-L@LISTS.PSU.EDU>
Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2002 4:31 PM
Subject: Highlander: The Musical LYRICS!!!!!
> May I humbly suggest....
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .
>
> Scene:
>
> Enter Stage Right: Methos and Duncan are walking across a bridge. It's
clear
> that they are having a friendly argument.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 15:31:18 +0200
From: Marina Bailey <tmar@sifl.iid.co.za>
Subject: Re: Highlander: The Musical LYRICS!!!!!
ZK wrote:
>It's been a long time since anyone did a filk on this list.
>Thanks.
I second that. Thanks for a good laugh, John! I think we all
needed one!
- Marina. (ZK, you must be slipping. Not one misspelling of
Richie. *Snerk*) (And I so miss whapping people...)
\\ "I'm naming all the stars." ||>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //
// "You can't see the stars, love. That's the || R I C H I E >> \\
\\ ceiling. Also, it's day." - Drusilla & Spike ||>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //
//=====Marina Bailey====tmar@sifl.iid.co.za=====|| \\
\\==============Chief Flag Waver and Defender of Richie============//
"I went to Chulak, and all I got was this lousy Goa'uld." - Stargate
T-shirt idea.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 15:31:20 +0200
From: Marina Bailey <tmar@sifl.iid.co.za>
Subject: Re: Highlander: The Musical
Sandy wrote:
>I agree. They got lucky a couple of times, and their luck has obviously
>run out.
You'd think they'd have learned their lesson by now.
>I enjoyed Raven, too. I liked the Paris eps more than the first half of
>the season. To me it started to feel more like HL when it moved to
>Paris. I thought the show had done well enough to warrant a second
>season... but NOT with Nick as an immortal. I'm hoping they knew the show
>wasn't going to be picked up when they came up with that idea.
I liked the Paris eps more too, but every time they walked past the
Seine I would get sad/mad/annoyed because the barge wasn't there!
That was sacrilege!
And... I dunno... they never really did any in-depth exploring of
what it would be like to be a new immie (or at least not enough
for my taste - I wanted to see RICHIE <g>). And in any case, Nick's
reactions would have been completely different, especially since he
didn't *want* to be immortal in the first place.
>Actually I've enjoyed all the Trek series and most of the movies.
I really disliked Voyager. But my favourite of the new ones has
been DS9. I've always been crazy about Sisko. :) (Although that
episode of Enterprise where Scott Bakula was taking a shower was
rather... yum. <g>)
- Marina.
\\ "I'm naming all the stars." ||>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //
// "You can't see the stars, love. That's the || R I C H I E >> \\
\\ ceiling. Also, it's day." - Drusilla & Spike ||>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //
//=====Marina Bailey====tmar@sifl.iid.co.za=====|| \\
\\==============Chief Flag Waver and Defender of Richie============//
"I went to Chulak, and all I got was this lousy Goa'uld." - Stargate
T-shirt idea.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 15:35:53 +0200
From: Marina Bailey <tmar@sifl.iid.co.za>
Subject: Re: Highlander: The Musical LYRICS!!!!!
Peggie wrote:
>ROTFLMAO
>John, You definitely have "a gift!" When can we expect Act II?
Well, I hope we get it soon. Because, let's face it, it's certainly
better than anything TPTB could come up with. (Plus, it has the
advantage of making us smile... something that didn't happen with
HL4.)
- Marina. (Feeling chatty today.)
\\ "I'm naming all the stars." ||>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //
// "You can't see the stars, love. That's the || R I C H I E >> \\
\\ ceiling. Also, it's day." - Drusilla & Spike ||>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //
//=====Marina Bailey====tmar@sifl.iid.co.za=====|| \\
\\==============Chief Flag Waver and Defender of Richie============//
"I went to Chulak, and all I got was this lousy Goa'uld." - Stargate
T-shirt idea.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 09:18:55 -0700
From: Lynn <lloschin@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Highlander the musical
From: "Tarryn Zank" <Zankt@NU.AC.ZA>
> How long has this project been in the workings? At the con last year
in LA, the PTB's
>were hinting at another HL series, that they couldn't tell us about,
because they still
>hadn't received 'backing' from the studios. But they did tell us it
was tentatively called
> HL: Trinity. So what's happened, is this 'musical' ('scuse me while
I hurl in a bucket -
> and no it's not musicals I hate, it's the thought of HL as one!) a
side project, or did the
> series concept fail so badly they had to scrape the barrel
My understanding is that the musical has nothing to do with a new
series -- they are separate projects.
> But seriously, is there not something that we as the Highlander
community can do?
IMO, anyone with a wish to do so can try and do anything they want,
but it will have no effect, and it will make those who do look pretty
pathetic. The bottom line is that TPTB own Highlander and they can do
anything they want to with the concept. If you don't like it, vote
with your pocketbook and don't support it -- that is the real power
that fans have. A petition or letter-writing campaign will accomplish
nothing, IMO, except making fans who participate look silly.
FWIW, I think the jury is out. (Yes, I know it's unpopular to wait
until the details are in rather than leaping to immediate conclusions
without any facts -- so sue me.) Unlike the "opera" concept, we've
heard almost no details about this, and I think it's premature to
assume they will use anything but the *concept* (as opposed to the
characters/plots from the movies/series), and the concept itself
certainly has the epic/timeless sweep of a musical. If skillfully
done and well-received, it could even bring new interest to the rest
of Highlander and help get a new series off the ground. Of course, it
could also be a total disaster and close in one week -- I guess time
will tell.
A lot of people thought bringing The Lion King to the stage would be
impossible, the result would be ridiculous and the show would
disappear quickly. So much for that.
Lynn
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 21:36:12 +0200
From: Marina Bailey <tmar@sifl.iid.co.za>
Subject: Re: Highlander the musical
Lynn wrote:
>FWIW, I think the jury is out. (Yes, I know it's unpopular to wait
>until the details are in rather than leaping to immediate conclusions
>without any facts -- so sue me.)
But, Lynn, it's *much* more fun to jump to conclusions and discuss
those! I mean, if we didn't do that, where would this list be??
:)
- Marina.
\\ "I'm naming all the stars." ||>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //
// "You can't see the stars, love. That's the || R I C H I E >> \\
\\ ceiling. Also, it's day." - Drusilla & Spike ||>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> //
//=====Marina Bailey====tmar@sifl.iid.co.za=====|| \\
\\==============Chief Flag Waver and Defender of Richie============//
"I went to Chulak, and all I got was this lousy Goa'uld." - Stargate
T-shirt idea.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 09:56:57 -1000
From: MacWestie <mac.westie@verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Highlander the musical
Lynn--
> My understanding is that the musical has nothing to do with a new
> series -- they are separate projects.
Yet they share the unmistakable "that sucks" quality.
> IMO, anyone with a wish to do so can try and do anything they want,
> but it will have no effect, and it will make those who do look pretty
> pathetic.
I'm certainly not going to bother w/ an anti-musical HL campaign, but I
think "pathetic" here applies to DPP trying yet again to wring cash from the
sadly gutted HL concept. And we KNOW that eventually they would HAVE to
release a producers' version of the failed musical, showing it as it SHOULD
have been done....
> FWIW, I think the jury is out. (Yes, I know it's unpopular to wait
> until the details are in rather than leaping to immediate conclusions
> without any facts -- so sue me.)
Speculation is legitimate at this point--what else is there now for HL fans,
after all? And a negative view is reasonable, in light of DPP's track
record. It's not like we don't know how they operate.
Nina (remember, the HL opera has witches, a DNA clone, an Eiffel Tower
penthouse, & a villain who makes Slan Quince seem multi-faceted)
mac.westie@verizon.net
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 18:16:25 -0400
From: Trilby <trilby23@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Highlander the musical
Lynn wrote:
> FWIW, I think the jury is out. (Yes, I know it's unpopular to wait
> until the details are in rather than leaping to immediate conclusions
> without any facts -- so sue me.) Unlike the "opera" concept, we've
> heard almost no details about this, and I think it's premature to
> assume they will use anything but the *concept* (as opposed to the
> characters/plots from the movies/series), and the concept itself
> certainly has the epic/timeless sweep of a musical. If skillfully
> done and well-received, it could even bring new interest to the rest
> of Highlander and help get a new series off the ground. Of course, it
> could also be a total disaster and close in one week -- I guess time
> will tell.
>
> A lot of people thought bringing The Lion King to the stage would be
> impossible, the result would be ridiculous and the show would
> disappear quickly. So much for that.
Thank you for making this point, Lynn. I was beginning to think I was
being extraordinarily naïve to believe that a HL musical could, quite
possibly, be a tremendous work of theatrical art. Or, of course, as
you point out, it could be a total humiliation for everyone involved.
There are dozens of smash-hit musicals that "everyone" said "couldn't
be done", or would "just be ridiculous and silly". Besides The Lion
King, look at Les Miserables, Sweeney Todd, Cats, Phantom of the
Opera, The Taming of the Shrew (Kiss Me Kate), A Chorus Line, The
Pirates of Penzance, Smiles of a Summer Night (A Little Night Music)
.... and these are only the ones that were great big ol' hits, and
that I can think of off the top of my head. There are even more that
weren't mega-hits but had respectable runs and good audience
reaction.
Then, of course, there are those that sank like a stone (some of
which are hailed today as "flawed masterpieces", and some of which
are just dreadful beyond words and deserved to die a mercifully quick
death).
The point is that if TPTB get the money AND the talent (music,
lyrics, dialogue, orchestration, set design, costume design, special
effects, and a thousand other creative people)(oh, yeah, and the
performers), they could conceivably create something wonderful.
Or something that would stink so badly I could smell it in Knoxville.
It could go either way. Given Endgame, I'm not going to be setting
my expectations too high, but I can certainly *hope* for a successful
musical set in the HL universe. It's not outside the realm of
possibility.
-------------------- Trilby
Music express what words can not explain, and on which it is
impossible to stay silent - Victor Hugo
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 18:36:22 -0400
From: Sandy Fields <diamonique@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Highlander the musical
At 06:16 PM 04/12/02, Trilby wrote:
>There are dozens of smash-hit musicals that "everyone" said "couldn't be
>done", or would "just be ridiculous and silly".
I agree. But they weren't produced by P/D.
OK.. I'll admit that HL could make a decent musical. But my real
apprehension stems from what we've gotten in the past -- particularly the
last movie. They had everything they needed to get it right... and yet
they got it all wrong.
So now they're switching gears and heading for the theater. Will they get
financial backing from entities that won't muck up the works with their own
issues? Will they get writers who are familiar with the HL concept? I'm
sure there are many other appropriate questions here, but I don't know a
whole lot about the workings of the theater, so I don't really know what
questions to ask. I just know that whatever can be messed up, P/D seems to
find a way to do it.
I wouldn't be looking for Duncan, Joe, et al... but I *would* be looking
for the HL universe; and that seems to be a concept that has slipped out of
P/D's grasp.
-- Sandy
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 13 Apr 2002 00:08:23 +0100
From: "John Mosby (B)" <a.j.mosby@btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Highlander the musical
As I recently pointed out during a debate on one of the Stargate lists, it
was not really practical to complain about that show's Season Six until
people had bothered to watch an episode of it first. Fine to say what they
thought was a bad idea, but to at least wait for final judgement until the
evidence was in.
I'm willing to do the same here, though I admit I have my doubts on the
musical. It would depend very much on the way an opera/musical was done.
Given that Duncan/Adrian and Connor/Christophe are so identifiable, simply
recasting the parts is inherently iffy, though not impossible. If recast
then the question would be whether an actor immitated the famous roles or
made it their own...a tricky balance. With The Liong King (which I was, I
admit, sceptical of initally) you are basing it on animated characters not
recognisable live-action heroes.
Of course, the Highlander side of things might not involve either character,
simply create a new one...with all the elements of immortality intact. Can a
concept that includes beheadings and Quickenings blend with traditional
stage sword-fighting? Possibly...I mean, I can hear Queen's music as part of
a musical stage production - as their recent announcement with Mr DeNiro
proves! And modern productions DO create amazing visual effects, though I'm
not sure that a family audience (key to profit-making) would appreciate
decapitation (and equally, Highlander without decapitation is...well....the
Animated Series!)
I think the main reason people are worried is that this is yet another
project that sounds all well-and-good at first glance but also has the
potential to fall embarassingly flat if handled badly. In recent years, God
Bless 'em, Davis-Panzer have failed to ignite the Highlander Fandom. Their
track-record, to say their least, isn't good.
1) A spin-off (Raven) that was, before it even started, fatally flawed in
that it was financed to be one thing, written to be another and promoted as
something else again. I didn't dislike it, but such a conflict of factors
was always going to sink it.
2) A film (Endgame) that was released, for whatever reason, unfinished and
was subsequently badly/unfairly promoted to audience. It also flew in face
of continuity, both internal and franchise-wide. It may have just about made
back its money in the long term, but an abysmal opening weekend in the face
of no competition says it all.
3) A Store that TPTB approve of being blatantly unprofessional and which has
just confirmed it apparently won't honour any disputed CC charges that date
back to before the recent shake-up (because of claims no records exist from
that period). Hardly a way to endear the very fans you're counting on.
(Incidentally - as promised I forwarded complaint e-mails to Davis-Panzer
around two weeks ago and promised a prime position for them to promote the
Store and reassure fans with any concerns. The deadline for a reply was
today. Zip. Nada.)
I wish any Opera/Musical all the best. I hope D/P and TPTB get it right. But
so far, I see lots of wild ideas and no decent follow through on
implimentation.
I'm absolutely willing to be proved wrong and would love to see (and cans ee
the potential of) a fantastic stage production. Just not holding my breath
or my wallet yet.
John
----- Original Message -----
From: "Trilby" <trilby23@bellsouth.net>
To: <HIGHLA-L@LISTS.PSU.EDU>
Sent: Friday, April 12, 2002 11:16 PM
Subject: Re: [HL] Highlander the musical
> Lynn wrote:
> > FWIW, I think the jury is out. (Yes, I know it's unpopular to wait
> > until the details are in rather than leaping to immediate conclusions
> > without any facts -- so sue me.) Unlike the "opera" concept, we've
> > heard almost no details about this, and I think it's premature to
> > assume they will use anything but the *concept* (as opposed to the
> > characters/plots from the movies/series), and the concept itself
> > certainly has the epic/timeless sweep of a musical. If skillfully
> > done and well-received, it could even bring new interest to the rest
> > of Highlander and help get a new series off the ground. Of course, it
> > could also be a total disaster and close in one week -- I guess time
> > will tell.
> >
> > A lot of people thought bringing The Lion King to the stage would be
> > impossible, the result would be ridiculous and the show would
> > disappear quickly. So much for that.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 15:07:22 -1000
From: MacWestie <mac.westie@verizon.net>
Subject: Re: Highlander the musical
Trilby--
> The point is that if TPTB get the money AND the talent (music,
> lyrics, dialogue, orchestration, set design, costume design, special
> effects, and a thousand other creative people)(oh, yeah, and the
> performers), they could conceivably create something wonderful.
Well, that's exactly right, as to the musical. It was also exactly right as
to HL2 & HL3, & as to HL:TS season 6, Raven, & Endgame. The general
principle even applies to retail, as in the infamously mismanaged HL Store.
(Do it right, & they will come, sort of.)
But, DPP has failed to do exactly what you outlined in all THOSE areas, over
several years. (Getting the money w/o fatally handing over control to
morons seems to be a major repeated problem for them. So much for learning
from mistakes.) So, WHY should we expect them to suddenly hit on all
cylinders when it comes to a musical production, which is a rather
specialized area where, as far as I know, DPP has NO experience, expertise,
contacts, etc. ???
Not gonna happen.
Nina
mac.westie@verizon.net
------------------------------
End of HIGHLA-L Digest - 11 Apr 2002 to 12 Apr 2002 (#2002-44)
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